… I really do! Lol
Especially after watching channel 4’s My Big Fat Gypsy Wedding which chronicles the rites of passage for Gypsy girls, which basically from watching the first show consists of planning for her wedding from the day she is born!
In between being born and the wedding, there are the rights of passage like attending other gypsy weddings to be ‘grabbed’
‘Grabbing’ basically means that when a gypsy boy likes a gypsy girl, he normally physically drags her off somewhere and tries to forcibly get a kiss from her; and by forcibly I mean twisting her arm until she concedes (Chinese burn anyone?) or as Cheyenne one of the gypsy girls featured on the show told us until the girl ‘get the boy off her’ (which includes saying no repeatedly and physically pushing and shoving him off).
The reason the girl says no or try’s to get the boy who is ‘grabbing’ off her is because gypsy girls despite how there appear; (in the show the girls were said to dress like prostitutes) have very high morals and there are traditions and customs to adhere to, such as no sex before marriage. To the point that a girl can not be seen to be with a guy who she is not married to alone for fear that her name will be scandalized; and even those boys and girls who have been betrothed to each other must be chaperoned when out together before they get married.
So as you can imagine the BDSS were doing what we do best… (If your not sure what we do best check out our blurb above) regarding these so called ‘gypsy customs’ and as you would expect from any discussion involving four different women, there were some serious difference in opinion…
Some of us were arguing… ‘Customs me a*s!’ and I quote: “if I wanted to get ‘grabbed’ I could just go down to Silks and Spice!” And “It just gives them an excuse to behaviour like Neanderthals”
Whilst others were not so much against the ‘gypsy customs’ in fact BDSS Bi throw out: “I would prefer a man to twist up my arm marry me and look after me, than chirps me with labrish and leave me high and dry “ :-D
Now in a way (and when put like that!) I had to agree with Bi because we have all heard and have become familiar with the constantly perpetuated idea that in the black community it comes like you (as a women) have to twist up a mans arm in order for him to marry you! (and your an education eligible women!)
Further more what the gypsy girls said they wanted in a man or actually a husband sounded pretty much the same as if you were to ask any women what they want in a man:
‘Loyal’, ‘don’t lay in the bed’ ‘gets up and goes to work’, ‘takes care of me’ ‘looks after me’ ‘someone who don’t beat
To be honest I can’t really remember all of what they said they wanted in a husband, but whilst they were saying it I can’t say that I disagreed! Lol
Not to mention the fairy tale wedding dress! What women would not like a gypsy wedding if not just to wear a massive white diamond encrust, corseted, see-through, split up the middle dress!? lol
So any way’s BDSS followers what do you think… are you like me and Bi, do you want a gypsy wedding? Also what did you make of the ‘gypsy customs’ feel free to have a ‘grab’ in comments (It lets us know that you like us!)
Ugh… if ever a man put his hands on me, trying to persuade me that we should kiss, or get married without my wanted to he will get an emphatic slap, that is in no way, its one thing to have an arranged marriage agreed upon by both parties and another to just say I am going to marry you off. The same can be said about this Gypsy tradition which for me does not fall under tradition it hides behind it but for it screams force remember that not all tradition is likeable… I come from a culture full of tradition, like not living together before you marry, going to see what English people would call a marriage advisor someone who gives you advice on how to conduct yourself as a wife, what to expect in married and what being a wife is all about.
ReplyDeletePersonally, I feel like there is something wonderful in a man finding out for himself that you are the woman he wants to spend the rest of his life with you, tradition is that the man proposes but if a woman feels like she has found her man I don’t see why she shouldn’t propose.
If you are having to twist a mans arm to marry you then you have a problem.
Underneath all this all women well most women want the same things, someone who supports, a dude who isn’t a bum, some smart someone who has manner blah blah blah, it remains if whatever you seek will be out there
For me it is a resounding NO I do not want a GYPSY wedding
What...not even so you can wear an outlandishy lavish dress?
ReplyDeleteStop lying every women wants a princess dress! lol
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ReplyDeleteI loved the last series of this show, purely because I enjoy weddings I enjoy seeing the bride looking gorgeous in her choosen dress and just the whole ceremony of the day.
ReplyDeleteHowever in all honesty the traditions shown would not work for me.
Marrying at such a young age, when your more concerned about how many lovehearts to have on your dress than anything else just shows that the maturity levels may not be there to enter into a marriage.
The idea that the man's place is out at work, while the woman's place is exclusively in the home.
Leaving school at a young age to be at home taking care of the house or whatever reason all of the above just does not sit well with me.
Yes they may get the fairytale wedding but it seems that you have to give up everything else.
However the programme only gives a small snapshot of the community, i'm sure there are many happily married couples out there.
I AM ALL UP FOR A GYPSY WEDDING!
ReplyDeleteHow many weddings do you know where you can pull up to church wearing clothes that you went to a shubeen down Dalston in the night before!
To be honest with you I can see the negative conotations that the Gypsy way of life may have such as grabbing, and I don't condone violence of any sort by the way! But I had to look at it like this....
A. Gypsy Girl- She is raised to know that she is expected to marry and cook, clean and raise a family from a young age. To find a match she can go with her friends to events and there she may be grabbed. She may relent and give in or kiss the guy. From then the guy will be vetted by her family, a dowry paid and she will shortly have A BIG FAT GYPSY WEDDING. The guy looks after is family and the saga continues
B. Western Girl - Isn't so sure what she requires in a man but know she wants to get married at sometime. She meets a guy at a rave, who grabs her arm, and they get talking. Before she knows it after a few dates they are having sex. She falls pregnant the guy leaves her (as he isn't ready for marriage) and she is left holding the house together.
Now I'm all for women being independant, but when people talk about womens rights etc, independance is mainly seen through work. To be honest I would be happy to be at home and take care of the kids if I was fully supported. But lets face it there are a lot of men out there that haven't been brought up with clear cut guidelines or just don't know what they need to do for their family, and there is a lot of dysfunction bercause of this.
Personally grabbing of the heart is a lot more painful that a grabbing of a arm, because this can stay with you forever, and takes a lot of soul searching to heal.
Now all arrange marriages aren't perfect and I believe that gypsy husbands are vetted before they are able to marry a potential bride. Goodness me if I had a few people vetted, it would have spared me a whole heap of drama! LOL
Right on Bi, could not agree more with your two scenerio's at least a Gypsy girl and guy know what is expected of them from birth vs the relationship drama of the non Gypsy girl/guy!
ReplyDeleteSel, I thought the couple who got married although young were very sweet, her talking about them growing old togather; and when you think about it getting married young was not such an usual thing back in the day... those customs/morals were actually the norm not just for the Gypsy but also everyone else.
Madeformakeup I agree the traditon may be used as a cover, however as you said every women basically wants the same thing a man to want them! lol
Also whether Gypsy or not I think women in general are conditoned from birth to want a man and/or a relationship... whether sucessful business women or uneducated Gypsy girl who left school at 11 to take care of home.. if they both fail at finding a mate they might both feel like failures.
Wow and in this weeks episode of my big fat gypsy wedding....more butterflies and hearts on the dresses.
ReplyDeleteAlthough I must admit I wouldnt mind arriving at my wedding in a pimped out monster truck! forget the Jorden-esque horse drawn carriage.
Not forgetting to mention the fire hazard dress...the lady was standing by with a fire extinguisher! ha-ha... that is big!
ReplyDeleteHi there I'm a Irish traveller been married since i was 19,and I'm married ten years,and i finished school at 16 and worked as a class room assistant till i got married,settled travellers or gypsy have to finish school its the law,you cant get away from that,as this so called grabbing thing not all groups of travellers or Gypsy's do this as i never did,and yes i was a virgin when i got married,and had a very big wedding which i still love looking back on,and my husband was my choice and its the same for all gypsy girls,and grabbing harmless flurting if these girls didn't want to be grabbed they wouldn't go out the party's in the first place,they want want the boy to get rough to get a kiss off them,so they boys wont say they were an easy grab,i hope this bring light on a few thing,
ReplyDeleteAnonymous thanks for posting its good to have someone posting who is a traveller and can talk about these things based on experience.
ReplyDeleteYes thanks anonymous for your insight!
ReplyDeleteSo I'm just wondering do you continue to work or is it once you are married you take care of the home? I mean Western culture is about women having it all a job, a relationship etc... is a travellers women's life fulfilling, I guess is what I'm asking!?
Also what do you make of non traveller relationship parlavars? and finally your dress! was it as big and as bright as the ladies featured on the show?
Obviously no pressure to answer, but its great that you wanted to give us an insight!
Watched the program again yesterday and I am still of the view that I do not want a big fat gypsy wedding, especially if as depicted by the program, you go from being under the control of your family to the control of your husband.
ReplyDeleteIt's definitely not for me.
Plus I do not agree with girls being pulled out of school to help take care of brothers and family. As much as I love my brothers I wouldn't want to have to spend my early teens cleaning up after them, while they do whatever they want. How must it feel to watch your brothers have so much freedom while yours are very limited.
Did you see the bare-knuckle fighting tonight?
ReplyDeleteI missed it today. Going to catch up on iplayer (or which ever player it is, right now I can't remember1)
ReplyDeleteAfter last weeks episode, I'm over my desire for a Gypsy wedding... can't have no man controlling me, lol!
hi i am a irish traveller and i just happenind to come across your site. thanks for what u put on your page it was lovely. us travellers we get so much aggro and people make our lives hell just for being a traveller but we will never change. dont get me wrong when u luk at the outfits that we wear yeh they do look slutty to you lot but to us they are gawjus its wat we like. but we like to dress like that coz it makes us feel attractive and it makes a boy look at u so 2 be honest that is good lol. but us travellers we dont have sex b4 marriage and if u do then u wont get married so u have to watch wat u do cause if a boy talks about u then u cud be scandalized which means u wont get married 2 a traveller. people looks at us in a differnet way which isnt fair. but for us all we want is to get married and have a good life cause thats all any girl wants really. yeh those dresses cost a lot of money but they are so worth it for one day u feel like a princess. and yeh i no wat they said on the show that the men will control but there is sum men there that can make there wives life a living torture but if any man tried to do that i wud literally kill him cause i have never known no abuse. and for the thing that they said that travellers only live to around 50 years old thats not true cause my granny died aged 71 and my great grandmother is still alive and she is around 90 years old. dont get me wrong sum people do die b4 they cum 50 cause i have known so much pain. my daddy died 6 years ago he was only 33 he died over guinness and vomit and my little cuzin died aged 7 he got ran over but they dont show nothing like that do they. they just assume stuff
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